LiIon
September 22nd, 2006As you probably all know, Lithium Ion (LiIon) batteries are inherently unstable. Only clever electronic circuitry and physical design saves them from exploding. Usually.
But not always. Dell and Apple laptops have recently been exploding all over; now, an IBM/Lenovo Thinkpad caught fire last weekend at LAX airport. It too had a Sony battery, apparently.
I can see a (probably justified) total airline ban on laptops soon. But then what: ban blackberries, cell phones and -shudder- digital cameras, because they all contain LiIon batteries? I don;t think our economy could survive it and I suspect I couldn’t, either.
Perhaps the manufacturers will make them safe enough soon. Meanwhile, read up if you are interested, here [link to WikiPedia article] - very interesting read.
September 23rd, 2006 at 1:07 am
At one time ALL batteries were banned from aircraft, because of the lack of safety venting, which could cause a mess at high altitudes.
I remember that regulation during a radio exam for operating airborne radios.
It is not only Lithium Ion batteries that can pose a fire risk, but all other types of high current batteries.
The Lithium Ion batteries of Sony manufacture just happened to attract the attention of the media..and a laptop going up in smoke and falme was hyped up like it was a huge explosion, when it was really a puff of smoke and a little flame.
I have seen portable radio batteries expire with the same dramatic display, usually caused by a short circuit in either the electronics that were being powered or by a defect or failure in the battery itself…such as was the case in the lithium ion incident.
I wonder if the laptops in the incidents were plugged into the mains and the batteries were on charge?
Internal shorts in lead acid batteries are even more dramatic at times.
The danger with all cells, and in particular Lithium Ion cells is that the demand is to make them smaller and lighter, yet increase their power capacity, so the result is a tightly packaged unit that is easily damaged by dropping or overheating etc and causing internal elements to contact each other.
Here we go again, the western world is going to collapse if Michael cannot carry his laptop, cellphone, mp3 player camera and god knows what else…(oh I forgot the toothpaste and the underearm deodorant) with him on an airplane…)…well maybe the underarm deodorant is needed
The batteries pose little risk if they are removed from the equipment and placed in a suitable container to protect them from rough handling, or leave them at home and power the laptop from the power on the aircraft…and the smaller batteries like used in cellphones, blackberries, and music players pose little risk because if they did, no one in their right mind would carry those devices in their pockets! …OUCH, now that would really hurt!
Remember the media hype about cellphones blowing up petrol stations and attracting lightning?
Well the danger from lithium batteries is almost as unreal, considering the number of them in service.
(Sorry Michael, but I just couldn’t control myself and had to make the personalized remark re collapse of the Western World…you left yourself wide open for that one, knowing that the likes of me is lurking in the shadows)!
September 23rd, 2006 at 7:05 am
Correction: No Apple batteries have exploded and Apple recalled them before there was an incident. My Powerbook was actually not effected (checked the serial number).
Currently, the airlines have taken a typical reactive, illogical approach. You cannot bring your Dell or Apple laptop with its battery aboard Virgin, Quantas and a couple other airlines no matter what model of notebook it is or if you’ve had your battery replaced. But the kicker? You have to remove it from your computer and stow it below decks - granted it’s unlikely the battery will explode if removed from the source but is it not worse to have your battery ignited where you can’t see it?
Largely an overhype I believe as the incidents have been rather isolated and is more a result of bad battery design. Someone tried to say their BlackBerry blew up too but our labs at work showed they had put it in a microwave. Mark had a car battery used to power radio equipment at his work explode and spray acid everywhere - fortunately, it wasn’t where anyone works and no one was around it, but they heard the pop from a couple floors up….and these are fairly common, stable tech.
September 23rd, 2006 at 11:36 am
Yes, much ado about nothing much.. except of course if a battery catches fire in the hold, this would not be a good thing. If this is a significant danger (as the Sony batteries may be), would be in favour of prohibiting batteries from checked luggage, not the other way around.
That guy running out af a plane at LAX last weekend with his laptop on fire is a pretty clear indication that it could get dangerous.
I like gel lead-acid batteries: if they explode, there’s no acid sprayed everywhere.
September 23rd, 2006 at 2:18 pm
The batteries in checked luggage won’t “explode” because they don’t have a charge going through them. They make you take your battery out of your laptop then seal them then check the batteries.
Of course the majority of the ignorant will go nuts with this and ban batteries from everything. Just like the ridiculous “don’t use your cellphone around gas stations” crap that went on with actual warnings at the pumps (this all quietly went away) but transmitting on radios was absolutely fine because it wasn’t using “cell waves”. Morons!
September 24th, 2006 at 11:42 pm
Well, first of all it does seem to have been actual explosions, not just slow burns. And I am not sure that the faulty batteries need to be in use (charging or discharging) for them to do this.
But yes, the hysteria will be silly, and the idiotic gas station hysteria is still around (I was shouted at in a big panic by the attendant the other day when I pulled out my cell phone at Sunoco).
September 26th, 2006 at 9:40 am
It all depends on what one would call an “explosion”!
I don’t think there were any body parts strewn about or windows blown out!
The problem is electrical and not chemical, as I understand it.
September 26th, 2006 at 9:43 am
It all depends on what one would call an “explosion”!
I don’t think there were any body parts strewn about or windows blown out!
The problem is electrical and not chemical, as I understand it.
I was at a gas station during the cellphone hysteria and gasoline, and was shouted at when the attended went into melt down because she saw me using my handheld radio, and when I explained it was a two way radio…she appologized and said that that was ok!
September 26th, 2006 at 9:46 am
Well, some news items suggest real explosions.
more worrying is this:
http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=3172
Quote:
Update (9/18/06): According to two posters on Engadget.com this incident occurred on Friday afternoon at LAX and was at Gate 77. The actual man whose laptop exploded confirms it was a ThinkPad T43: “And yes, it’s a ThinkPad T43. I don’t know if it was a Sony battery - I can’t tell now that it’s a charred mess, but my guess is that it was if they made them for IBM. I was using it 30 minutes before and it had no problems. It was even turned off and in my bag when it caught fire. So even if the computer is off, there’s still a risk of a fire - now that’s scary.”
September 28th, 2006 at 10:37 pm
I have a Stinkpad T46 I think. We just got word at work to check the IBM Website. I’m not very worried given how many notebooks are in the wild and really how rare this is given that number.